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Thèid a h-uile iarrtais eadar-theangachaidh air imrich a-bhos an-seo. Ma bhios thu seachd sgìth dhaibh, na rach ann an-seo.
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akerbeltz
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Unread postby akerbeltz » Tue Jul 14, 2009 8:11 pm

Cup of tea = cupp (a) (tea), they're the same form, just reduced to various degrees.

I DID say that there are gray areas <sigh>... Yes, I've never heard people say *cup(an) (a) theatha/chofaidh either. But that doesn't negate the underlying principle...

There are several possible explanations for this formation.

1) Let's remind ourselves that these are relative newcomers to the language and may not fit into the system as smoothly as others.

2) It may be a case of A standing for B. As in, at an internal level, these drinks may be stored under "container for drinking X". Languages excel at that kind of thing. For example, brand based common nouns use that effect. A hoover doesn't have to be by Hoover and a kleenex doesn't have to be by Kleenex. In the High Court said..., the court didn't say anything, it's a building. But in our mind the building and the people who sit on it are the same at some level. The list is endless.

So, when we're offering cupan cofaidh at the subliminal level that language is stored, the container may stand for the drink itself. So in Gaelic people may be offering you a teacup but since an empty teacup is pointless, it amounts to the same thing.

The fact that English actually offers the drink in cup of tea (not teacup) (except in cuppa which is an interestingly confusing case) needn't worry us. It's a different language after all.

These are our main two options. Without someone doing serious research into mental representations and suchlike, I cannot say for certain but I'd tend to option 2.

Interesting thought... if you were offering someone a pint or gallon of coffee, I'm pretty certain a native speaker (or at least some) would put that as pinnt/galan a chofaidh as the emphasis here would be rather different than in the cup thing.

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Unread postby Níall Beag » Tue Jul 14, 2009 8:38 pm

Thrissel wrote:Aorist? Bha mi a' smaoineachadh nach robhar a' cleachdadh sin ach sa Ghreugais?!

I think it was Gilles who first explicitly identified the Gaelic future/habitual as being aorist in aspect....

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Unread postby Níall Beag » Tue Jul 14, 2009 8:42 pm

akerbeltz wrote:These are our main two options. Without someone doing serious research into mental representations and suchlike, I cannot say for certain but I'd tend to option 2.

Given that "gabhaidh mi pinnt" more often than "gabhaidh mi leann", I'd tend to agree.

It may also be related to the fact that we're dealing with uncountables....


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