How can I amend...

Thèid a h-uile iarrtais eadar-theangachaidh air imrich a-bhos an-seo. Ma bhios thu seachd sgìth dhaibh, na rach ann an-seo.
gingerheid
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How can I amend...

Unread postby gingerheid » Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:09 am

Hello

I would be very grateful for some help...

I am in proud possession of a lovely t-shirt for a ceilidh band I've joined.

It has the slogan "Ceannaich pinnt dhomh"

I don't know if this is Scots or Irish Gaelic, but I'm led to believe it means something similar to "make mine a pint".

If it's Scots Gaelic, qould anyone be able to tell me how this might be amended to include a reference to Irn Bru?

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Unread postby akerbeltz » Mon Jun 29, 2009 1:01 am

It's Scottish Gaelic alright. Irish would be Ceannaigh pionta dom.

Just swap the pinnt for Irn Bru I guess, so Ceannaich Irn Bru dhomh.

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Unread postby gingerheid » Mon Jun 29, 2009 1:35 am

Many thanks!

Is there any way, even half grammatically correct, I could change it to a request for a pint of Irn Bru just by adding words to the end?

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Unread postby akerbeltz » Mon Jun 29, 2009 3:26 am

No, it has to come before the dhomh, so Ceannaich pinnt Irn Bru dhomh, literally buy! pint (of) Irn Bru to-me.

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Unread postby faoileag » Mon Jun 29, 2009 7:35 am

If you just want to add something to the existing t-shirt, I suggest you write '(ach Irn Bru!)' after the slogan - that means - 'but Irn Bru'.

Or even, at a push, ' - de Irn Bru! ' or ' - d' Irn Bru' - of Irn Bru'.

Dè do bheachd, Mr A.? :P

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Unread postby akerbeltz » Mon Jun 29, 2009 11:51 am

Well, I was trying to keep it simple for our (presumably not Gaelic speaking friend here) :priob:

The partitive is required after pinnt but de in this position is colloquially often reduced to a. Working on the basis of a dialect that doesn't add the dh', pinnt uisge/pinnt Irn Bru would be ok as a colloquial statement.

Being 100% grammatical in one of the other dialects, true, you'd get
pinnt de dh'uisge/de dh'Irn Bru
or
pinnt a dh'uisge/a dh'Irn Bru

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Unread postby Níall Beag » Mon Jun 29, 2009 4:01 pm

I thought pinnt ruled a genitive! I'm getting more and more confused. I really have to learn Gaelic soon.

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Unread postby akerbeltz » Mon Jun 29, 2009 4:07 pm

No, it's the partitive thing. If you talk about a subset of a large, amorphous mass, in Gaelic that normally requires de. Liquids and grainy things are the best examples of this group:
punnd a shiùcar
pinnt a dh'uisge
cupa de dh'fhlùr

etc

You CAN get the genitive after words like pinnt of course since it's a noun but technically, that's a different thing. It's more obvious with some other examples:
cupa siùcair = a sugarcup
cupa de shiùcar = a cup of sugar
gloine fìona = a wineglass
gloine de dh'fhìon = a glass of wine

So I guess a pinnt uisge would be a water-pint (if that was perhaps a different size from a pinnt làgair; cf american and british gallons) whereas pinnt de dh'uisge would actually get you some water, not an empty glass or other liquid measure.

And then of course there are grey areas and mistakes that both learners and native speakers make so the above aren't gospel but serve to illustrate the idea behind the system.

Make more sense?

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Unread postby gingerheid » Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:00 am

Many thanks!

I play the pipes, but know about three words of Gaelic at a push! However, on the other hand of course I wouldn't want to mangle too dreadfully something that has the language on it!

Ever since I emigrated to England my mission to persuade people who sadly don't know better about the merits of our other national drink has become a running joke, and I feel the t-shirt really needs to reflect this!

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Unread postby neoni » Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:41 pm

chan fhaca mi duine sam bith bruidhinn air a' phartative ann an cànan sam bith ach suomais :?

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Unread postby Seonaidh » Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:18 pm

Ay, that seann phartative boring! Instrumental! Locative! Aorist! Pluperfect subjunctive! Middle voice! An urrainn duinn canan a mharbhadh le terminology?

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Unread postby Thrissel » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:25 pm

Aorist? Bha mi a' smaoineachadh nach robhar a' cleachdadh sin ach sa Ghreugais?!

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Unread postby Tearlach61 » Sat Jul 11, 2009 6:21 pm

Thanks akerbeltz! I've been scratching my head on that one for years going by gut as much as anything. It brings to mind the phrase: 'cuid de dhaoine', I guess if it's analogous to that, then it would take 'de'

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Unread postby An Gobaire » Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:09 pm

You CAN get the genitive after words like pinnt of course since it's a noun but technically, that's a different thing. It's more obvious with some other examples:
cupa siùcair = a sugarcup
cupa de shiùcar = a cup of sugar
gloine fìona = a wineglass
gloine de dh'fhìon = a glass of wine


If this is correct, then why do we say An gabh thu cupa teatha? Meaning "a cup of tea". I've never heard anyone say "An gabh thu cupa de theatha"!
Dèan buil cheart de na fhuair thu!

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Unread postby Seonaidh » Tue Jul 14, 2009 7:55 pm

Uill, chan eil mi cinnteach idir, ach tha mi a' creidsinn gur e seòrsa shorthand (?làmh ghoirid?) a th' ann. Chan eil mi air mòran daoine a chluinntinn ag ràdh "cup of tea" nas motha, ach tha mòran ag ràdh "cuppa tea" no "cuppa" nach eil. Agus tha "pinta" airson pinnt bainne sa Bheurla nach eil? Dè seòrsa Gàidhlig a tha agad? No Dè seòrsa de Ghàidhlig a tha agad, 's dòcha...


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