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three main questions for beginner

Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:07 pm
by Eain
Hallò evryone, i'm just fresh in gaelic, so I have many questions.

Three questions:
1. how much dialects in scottish gaelic? Which one's pronounciation is taught in school books and any language courses?
2.how to say off-topic? :)
3. is thare any kind of nasalizations in gaelic, like urú in irish?

Le meas,
Eain

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:48 pm
by Níall Beag
Eain wrote:1. how much dialects in scottish gaelic? Which one's pronounciation is taught in school books and any language courses?
How many colours are in a rainbow? It's hard to define "a dialect" as they all blur into each other.
3. is thare any kind of nasalizations in gaelic, like urú in irish?
There's no grammatical nasalisation, but vowels are often nasalised before mh. The less the MH is pronounced, the more of the M's nasal character is picked up by the vowel.

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 2:04 pm
by Eain
Níall Beag wrote:
Eain wrote:1. how much dialects in scottish gaelic? Which one's pronounciation is taught in school books and any language courses?
How many colours are in a rainbow? It's hard to define "a dialect" as they all blur into each other.
3. is thare any kind of nasalizations in gaelic, like urú in irish?
There's no grammatical nasalisation, but vowels are often nasalised before mh. The less the MH is pronounced, the more of the M's nasal character is picked up by the vowel.
1. I mean, looking at irish, it's three dialects - northern, western, and southern. All are separated. Is in Gaìdhlig the same situation, or dialects just flow into each other?

2. Can you show some examples with this 'before mh'?

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:10 pm
by akerbeltz
There are perhaps 5 large dialect groupings that are relevant today. Lewis, Southern Hebrides, Skye, Wester Ross, Argyll.

There is a type of eclipsis (úrú) in Gaelic. It's slightly different from Irish in the sense it's synchronic, not diachronic. That means that after certain nasals (especially the definite article if it ends in -n) the following consoant is affects. But only if the -n is actually still a phoneme. In Irish this works even if the n is only nominally in existance eg ocht gcait vs Gaelic ochd cait. This is not written in Gaelic as it's a natural result of morphophonemics. The outcome varies from dialect to dialect. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:30 pm
by faoileag
Mòran taing, Akerbeltz, I am definitely not going to worry about it!

Eain:
Examples of 'nasal' 'o' before 'mh':

còmhla ri - together with
Didòmhnaich - Sunday
Dòmhnall

(Is that what you meant, a Nèill?)

Sorry, can't do more sophisticated phonetic transcription.

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:53 am
by Níall Beag
Yup, a Fhaoilig, that's what I was getting at.

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:12 pm
by akerbeltz
That type of nasalisation is also especially common near disappearing or historic nasals such as cunntas, cumhachd, teanga etc

Re: three main questions for beginner

Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 12:45 pm
by Eain
Hallo, again. I wonder, on what speaking norm, grammar rules dialect is based standard scottish aelic?