Fòram na Gàidhlig

Bha iad a-mach air Ulpan a-nochd air BBC Alba. Chan eil mòran luchd-ionnsachaidh a' fàs fileanta idir, idir mar a bha Deisleal Ltd agus Bòrd na Gàidhlig an dùil.
Seo bho na Hearald an-diugh:

"The organisation charged with saving Gaelic from extinction has admitted it will fail to achieve one of its key targets.

Two years ago Bòrd na Gàidhlig (BnG), the principal public body promoting and developing Gaelic, committed itself to 1600 adult learners completing a new Gaelic course by the end of next month.

It now says that cannot be achieved. It does not yet know what the final figure will be, but The Herald has established that in the Highland Council area, where around 200 people were following the course, only about a dozen have completed it.

Although it has achieved its goal of 2000 adults taking up the Ulpan method of Gaelic learning, a spokesman for BnG confirmed it would miss the target it set for March 31, despite giving out funding of £250,000 for courses to be developed in this financial year alone."

Gheibhear tuilleadh an seo: http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home ... c.16666326

"tuiteam às a' cheile"? That's a little bit strong.

I have never seen any course achieve an 80% completion rate. I think Deiseil and BnaG both knew that, and saw the two as totally different targets.

Consider this study. OK, so Rosetta Stone is particularly bad, and although I've not tried Tell Me More, I've yet to find a computerised language package that genuinely teaches a language, but completion rates of 0.6% and 2.2%? The author then mentions his own research based on wear and tear of language books in libraries coming to a very similar conclusion and shows how quickly American students drop languages. 82% dropout rate in 2000. Yes, the reality is that most people don't finish courses.

One study I saw about Welsh Wlpan managed a 75% completion rate, but this was done in Cardiff University, which is one of the best places to study, with highly motivated and very experienced teachers. By virtue of being a "university", it attracts more students that you'd probably describe as "serious". Even matching that from 2000 starters would only mean 1500 finishers, but of course we wouldn't expect Deiseil to match that, because we're not comparing like with like.

The 12-out-of-200 statistic seems much more typical of language courses the world over, which is acknowledged in the design and aims of Ùlpan: if you've got no fixed syllabus, you can't just move from class to class, and as attrition reduces the size of the class you are taking, it's eventually going to fold, and you're left with no progression. If there's one good thing come out of Ùlpan, it's the move towards a sort of "national syllabus for Gaelic", and even if the order of teaching isn't what I'd like, it certainly gives a starting point.

So they were set one goal that was achievable, and one goal that was pretty much impossible from the start. It's not like they've broken any contracts or anything, as they didn't get the full sum to start off with -- the way these things work is that you don't get the all the money until you meet the targets. Targets partially achieved, money partially awarded. Fair's fair.

I'm hoping the news will start attracting more commenters to discuss the actual content and delivery of the course -- one of the problems with academic papers on learning methods is that course dropouts don't generally respond to feedback surveys....

It's also a shame that the one quoted critic of the course is most likely someone with an axe to grind and with no direct experience of Ùlpan.

I'm not a fan of Ùlpan, but that quote smacks of self-serving dishonesty....

Bha cuideigin air An La (a tha ag obair airson a' BhBC i-fhèin) a gearain gu mòr gun robh Ulapn do-thuigsinneach dhi (incomprehensible a thuirt i sa Bheurla) as dèidh beagan uine air sgàths nach robh gràmar am broinn a' chùrsa.
"if you've got no fixed syllabus, you can't just move from class to class" 2007 agus mise sa Bhreatiainn Bheag. Bha Brezhoneg ga theagaisg le Ulpan aig Oilthigh Rennes 2 agus air an oidhche teas meadhan sa bhaile sa choimhearsnachd. Bha cothrom an dà chuid leantainn gun cus trioblaid. Bha trì leabhraichean agus CDs ri cheannaich, rudeigin nach eil ann le Ulpan Gàidhlig cho fhad 's aithne dhomh agus a bheil e fìor ri ràdh nach d'fhuair Ulpan a-steach oilthigh albannach sam bith gu ruige seo?
Co-dhiù tha mise fhathast eadar dà bheachd. Horses for courses?

Tha mi fhèin a' creidsinn an an Horses for courses. Feumaidh na horses a' tuigsinn dè na courses a tha ann co-dhiù agus bhiodh e math a' mìneachadh do na h-oileanaich dè ro-innleachdan a tha ann gus cànan ionnsachadh ach an urrainn dhaibh an t-slighe a tha freagarrach dhaibh a leantainn.

Dhomhsa dheth, bhiodh an cùrsa as fheàrr a tha a' tabhainn measgachadh den a h-uile rud ach am faigh a h-uile duine rudeigin ann a tha freagarrach dhaibh.

A thaobh an attrition rate, thòisich mi fhìn air 3 cànanan far nach do rinn mi ach a' chiad cùrsa, air sgàth 's nach robh ùine gu leòr agam gus an obair a dhèanamh a bha a dhìth gus a bhith soirbheachail. Soilidh mi gu bheil seo na bacadh as motha don fheadhainn a bhios ag obair làn-thìde is ro sgìth air an fheasgair gus càil sam bith ionnsachadh.

Uill, tha mi air coimhead air An Là a-nis, agus tha iad fhathast ag radh an aon seòrsa sgudal 's a bha iad riamh. Israel? 40% success rate. Wales? I've seen a study claiming a 53% success rate, but that was on a small sample from one school... the University of Cardiff, so not your typical newly-certified, part-time teachers, but some of the most experienced and best qualified teachers in the country.

Ach tha iad fhathast ag radh nach eil Ùlpan ag obair ann a' sheo air sgàth an t-suidheachadh, ged nach eil e ag obair gu sònraichte math ann an àite sam bith....

Gràisg wrote:Bha cuideigin air An La (a tha ag obair airson a' BhBC i-fhèin) a gearain gu mòr gun robh Ulapn do-thuigsinneach dhi (incomprehensible a thuirt i sa Bheurla) as dèidh beagan uine air sgàths nach robh gràmar am broinn a' chùrsa.

Cha dèanadh mise airgmead ri sin, ach tha mi den bheachd gur e seo an trioblaid as motha le cùrsa bogaidh sam bith -- Ùlpan no TIP no Communciative Approach no TPRS no Direct Method no Callan Method ... ged bi dè.

Dhomhsa, chan eil mòran diofair ann mu dheidhinn dè an cùrsa/dòigh a chleachdar. Le Gàidhlig, chan eil mòran cothruim ann leis an luchd-ionnsachaidh da cleachdadh taobh a-muigh de dh'àite an ionnsachaidh. Dè sin - dìth reinforcement, 's dòcha. Agus cuiridh seo taic don tionndadh a thuiteam a-mach. Seo cearcall garg - dìth coimhearnachd Gàidhlig => dèanamh coimhearsnachd Gàidhlig le teagasg, ionnsachadh => feum air àite cleachdaidh => chan eil àite cleachdaidh ann => chan eil mòran Gàidhlig air a h-ionnsachadh => dìth coimhearsnachd Gàidhlig.

Bha mi a' coimhead air stataistigean Gàidhlig ann am Fìobha, agus seo rud car inntinneach. Ann an Anstruther Easter, Dunbog, Flisk, Logie agus Newburn, bha aonar ann aig an robh Gàidhlig (2001). A bheil cànan beò far nach eil ach aonar ann ga bhruidhinn? Cò bhios ag èisteachd riutha? Cò bhios a' cur freagairt dhaibh? Càit' a bheil a' choimhearsnachd Ghàidhlig an siud? Fiù far a bheil a' Ghàidhlig làidir - m.e. 177 daoine ga bruidhinn ann an Dùn Phàrlan - bidh iad air call am measg nan 60,000+ duine an sin aig nach eil a' Ghàidhlig.